tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post9125281342954362001..comments2023-09-23T11:16:00.352+02:00Comments on The Franco-American Flophouse has moved: Robert Morris on FATCAVictoria FERAUGEhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16319699673885400472noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-79738906040284316432014-01-13T11:56:20.326+01:002014-01-13T11:56:20.326+01:00@Christophe, Fabulous links. Thank you. On my to...@Christophe, Fabulous links. Thank you. On my to-read list is Christian Chavagneaux's Les paradis fiscaux. <br /><br />@Robert, it was my pleasure and I liked the book very much. I hope that was properly conveyed in my review. If not, well, let me say it here.<br /><br />@Just Me, Got similar reactions from folks in southeast Asia.<br /><br />@anonymous, can't entirely blame them. The US has a lot of problems right now. The trick is to point out that FATCA not only won't help fix it but could actually make it worse.Victoria FERAUGEhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16319699673885400472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-66751756050989252652014-01-11T20:09:50.677+01:002014-01-11T20:09:50.677+01:00Just back from the mountains - where the internet ...Just back from the mountains - where the internet connexion is lousey - so I've just read this remarkable piece. Great work Victoria ! This is true journalism. It's all said so well. <br />Funny thing. Nobody back home, except for Nina, seems to be taking any of this seriously. Or do they know about it ???Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-89752003885374730192014-01-09T19:04:40.418+01:002014-01-09T19:04:40.418+01:00Thanks for adding this review to the FATCA debate....Thanks for adding this review to the FATCA debate. Just wished more Homelanders would consider what is being created. Of course, much of what we think we see is speculation, and we will only know in the fullness of time. I might not agree with some of yours, but one would be crazy to think FATCA and the evolution to GATCA will NOT have serious repercussions for the global economy. <br /><br />There will be winners and losers, and frankly many more losers than anyone considers, imho. It is a level of Control unimaginable in an earlier time, and what it means for the global market and the millions of individual decisions that will be made as a result will only be known in retrospect. <br /><br />Wait for 'how we got here' book. "FATCA, what happened?" <br /><br />On the point of elitist and racist policy, not by intention but by impact, I think Robert is onto something here. When I told an American friend who is doing business in Africa he just laughed at the possibility that the banks he deals with will be able to comprehend and comply with FATCA.<br />The language barrier is a BIG one, and sophistication a challenge. It is still paper ledgers and rubber stamps there! How are they going to do it, and what does that do to their integration into a global economy if they are shut out and penalized. <br /><br />Of course China maybe their answer, because they are ubiquitous in African development. (America almost doesn't exist in contrast) If China doesn't go along with the U.S. dollar extortion game, it will be interesting to watch how this develops.Just Menoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-31713793774758616092014-01-08T17:44:21.383+01:002014-01-08T17:44:21.383+01:00Wow. Many thanks for the kind review. I hope you...Wow. Many thanks for the kind review. I hope you are right about my over-confidence in FATCA's potential. If the US was forced to back down on this, it would be a great sign and precedent for international governance generally. <br /><br />Thanks for reading and reacting in such a perceptive manner!Robbohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09984590019244936669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-56391066678415808282014-01-08T01:00:29.461+01:002014-01-08T01:00:29.461+01:00I don't know personally of any banks in the UK...I don't know personally of any banks in the UK closing accounts of "US persons" as in Switzerland and elsewhere. However, it's frightening how easily a bank can just summarily close an account without any explanation in the UK. There are now cases of account closures that are presently being challenged in courts as breeching the Equality Act (2010), as the account closures appeared to be based solely on ethnic/national origin :<br />http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03nrlyn <br />(you have to forward to 6:34 into the programme). It might also be a basis for "US Persons" in the UK to challenge account closures due to FATCA. Apologies, this might have slightly veered off the topic of the original post.Patricknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-51103742592928593772014-01-07T23:23:25.132+01:002014-01-07T23:23:25.132+01:00Maybe an interesting follow up read: « La richesse...Maybe an interesting follow up read: « La richesse cachée des nations – Enquête sur les paradis fiscaux »<br /><br />En Francais dans le texte:<br />http://centpapiers.com/?p=155816<br /><br />There is mention and analysis of FATCA.<br /><br />And a message from John Koskinen, the newly confirmed IRS commissioner:<br />http://www.bna.com/koskinen-says-improving-n17179881183/<br /><br />Speaking to reporters during a 45-minute meeting Jan. 6, Koskinen said implementing both the Affordable Care Act and the Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act are key goals, with FATCA expected to provide a significant amount of information to help the IRS fight offshore tax evasion.<br /><br />"It symbolizes “the increasing capacity of the IRS and the U.S. to be able to track down offshore accounts and those who have been avoiding income taxes,” Koskinen said. FATCA is expected to be a big step forward in tax compliance, he said."Christophenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-19297094425121456212014-01-07T15:32:19.169+01:002014-01-07T15:32:19.169+01:00@bubblebustin, Yep, I think they have committed an...@bubblebustin, Yep, I think they have committed and they will only back off if it's a total disaster. Perhaps the IGAs are their way of backing off and saving face.<br /><br />@anonymous, I think your right. Most didn't think it through but I do believe that there were some that had and got Congress to pass it by simply not giving them the entire picture.I have wondered how much of Stack's letter was in fact addressed to Congress who are surely getting letters and emails from their constituents. I wonder how many asked "what the hell is going on here?"<br /><br />I also concur that the big fish are long gone. I just can't see anyone with money and access to exepnsive cross-border tax expertise just sitting there waiting to be outed. Where did they go? Who knows but nobody is sharing that information.<br /><br />@P. Moore - Yes, we ain't seen nothing yet. It will go the courts. I think the duals will be at the firefront of this and we will see cases at the European Court of Justice. But one way they could back off is by a series of gentleman's agreements like say that the duals won't be touched. So there will be the rules and all kinds of little exceptions. At least that's what I read when I see some of the rather fuzzy language in the French IGA.<br /><br />@Kermit, Thanks for the suggestion. I went ahead and did it this morning.Victoria FERAUGEhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16319699673885400472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-61965980084486103322014-01-07T02:16:12.699+01:002014-01-07T02:16:12.699+01:00Victoria, you should post this as an article on IB...Victoria, you should post this as an article on IBS. There is lots to chew on for the commentators. As usual your writing is excellent. Kermitkermitziihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12563438755645035854noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-21203561688929345052014-01-07T00:59:53.214+01:002014-01-07T00:59:53.214+01:00> I expect the real screaming will start when t...> I expect the real screaming will start when the general public in various countries understand what is actually going on and what they are paying for.<br /><br />Will the general public ever know what they're paying for (except for US persons who will be asked for proof of US tax compliance and will have to sign W8 forms)? I am afraid the higher costs will just be explained by the cost of compliance in general. I hope lawsuits are going to start coming mainly due to discrimination reasons. Foreign banks should not close US persons accounts. We'll see what they do with regards to joint accounts with non US persons.<br /><br />As for the IRS/treasury delaying some more, we'll see. They said "no more delay!" :-)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-39595964351257762752014-01-06T22:56:08.204+01:002014-01-06T22:56:08.204+01:00Very interesting analysis, Victoria. I find it fa...Very interesting analysis, Victoria. I find it fascinating to see all the criticism and counter-criticism about FATCA when I consider the REAL action has yet to begin. I expect the real screaming will start when the general public in various countries understand what is actually going on and what they are paying for. Of course, if this thing proceeds with any force, there will be the inevitable court challenges as well. I also agree with you...it is highly suspect that the IRS and Treasury will really be able to pull off this poorly crafted plan. Right now I am waiting to see if they come up with yet another implementation extension or if they will try to push ahead in some messy sloppy fashion.<br /><br />As far as I can figure, there can be no 'Global Standard' of information exchange on a CBT basis, so to do so would mean a major concession for the US. P. Moorenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-59269151372764507802014-01-06T18:14:40.374+01:002014-01-06T18:14:40.374+01:00Good comment, Anonymous. I don't believe howev...Good comment, Anonymous. I don't believe however, that the Justice Department is going after Swiss banks so much as Swiss banks are categorizing themselves out of fear of being later found to have some kind of liability later - similar to the minnows who entered OVDI.<br /><br />Any global standard must be done by consensus, not by diktat. This is not a consensus, but an act of aggression thinly veiled by the US as the US taking the lead on the fight against offshore tax evasion. FATCA will change the world, but not for the better I'm afraid, because if the world follows by example, greed and nationalism will rule the future of our planet.bubblebustinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01789474207408205280noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-60398555277524177462014-01-06T17:43:06.914+01:002014-01-06T17:43:06.914+01:00Great analysis, Victoria. I agree with everything ...Great analysis, Victoria. I agree with everything you said.<br />I think it was just irresponsible for the senators who introduced FATCA to have slipped it in another bill, like they did, without extensive analysis, without everyone being aware of what they were voting on.<br />FATCA was an emotional reaction to the 2009 UBS scandal. They introduced it without thinking a second that their threats of shutting banks from the US market would alienate US citizens abroad. They did not connect the dots between FATCA and CBT.<br />If the goal was to introduce an international standard, this should not have been stealth legislation. They went at it the wrong way. You don't introduce an international standard by threatening everyone who don't agree with it to exclude them from the US market. They should have worked with the OECD on this to craft something together.<br />I don't understand why, instead of going ahead with FATCA's implementation, they're not working together toward that more global goal. At this point, I think the US got what they wanted: raising interest for a global automatic exchange of information. Now, they should work with global authorities to implement it.<br />In the meantime, their John Doe requests work just fine to catch big fish.<br /><br />I have a couple concerns with this war on tax evasion. I don't think they'll catch many big fish anymore.<br />Big fish have already been warned and either worked around the new rules or have already straightened their financial situation.<br /><br />Also, I don't really understand the persecution that the US is doing against ALL Swiss banks. This guilty assumption without having proof and systematically going after all the banks is just wrong.<br />Canada should indeed be concerned that they might be the next target.<br /><br />Lastly, knowing the potential fines for inadvertent FBAR violations, and how they're treating people with foreign accounts, how are the non-compliant "normal" people whose info is going to be transmitted going to be treated? Is this going to generate mass panic?<br />Given the level of non-compliance, I would not be surprised if the US was flooded with data.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2424131704277823220.post-61236956056558061782014-01-06T16:38:33.999+01:002014-01-06T16:38:33.999+01:00Truth is, no other nation would pay FATCA any heed...Truth is, no other nation would pay FATCA any heed if it wasn't for the 30% withholding. Kind of creates a new precedent for the US and the rest of the world's future behaviour doesn't it.<br /><br />By the sounds of it, FATCA will shut the US out of emerging markets. <br /><br />Frankly there aren't enough forward thinking people in Congress to kill FATCA before it's done its damage. If there were, FATCA never would have been introduced and made into law in the first place. The motto of US lawmakers should be "ready, shoot, aim".bubblebustinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01789474207408205280noreply@blogger.com